Title: Skeptics Guide #218 - Sep 23 2009

" You're listening to the skeptics guide to give you give us your escape. -- reality."

" Hello and welcome to this skeptics guide to the universe. Today as of Wednesday September 23 designate in this York post Stephen -- joining me this week about -- Everybody Rebecca Watson. Islands chain of bella think guys and -- Bernstein Lowe's 1999. NASA announced they lost contact with the Mars might. On this day yet that was unharmed and had a good -- for us it was the old Patrick slash imperial makes. Yes put in the ordinance there that I hate when that happens it at a -- I'm wife who."

" It says here according to information the navigation data provided by the software their reasoning was not cross checked well -- flight. And it was not adequate tested before the launch. And that's -- off course during its -- entered the martian -- lower than planned and destroyed by atmospheric friction right it's."

" You know quite honestly it's amazing that -- hunk of metal millions of while miles away and hit another rock in the middle of space. And have -- landed and do stuff you're totally amazing -- that half the time something goes wrong that's acceptable in my book yeah. And there there are an amazing number of gorgeous failures -- ropes have trying to get to Mars. Soviets have to leave at a lot of them yeah so basically kudos to our guys for. Not screwing up most of the time USA. Did it and it it is it a well we have a very interesting interview coming up later in the show concerning this singularity summit and artificial intelligence and all that but first wouldn't -- if you news items. And that you're gonna tell us about raptor Rex. Yeah raptor -- so well actually is that wrapped directs or is it rap --"

" Ex. Raptor Rex raptor X makes it sound like -- hot new raptor yeah -- or. Our -- like -- next at bat directs but wrapped -- Tor exit this delicate superhero war. Video -- yeah that's right I agree that. Or a case for. Paleontologist Paul Sereno. And is a five co authors are describing your newly discovered dinosaur. That it was published in September 17 science express which is a online journal science. What they discovered. What was brought to their attention. And they have identified as a -- a nine foot tall dinosaur that was uncovered in northeastern China that has. All the hallmark anatomical features of its descendant tyrannosaurus Rex. But raptor X was around 125. Million years ago that's a sixty million years prior to -- And when I say it has all of the hallmark anatomical features. Everything from the size of its head to its size of its brain inside that -- to be small arms that in OT -- is -- famous. It isn't the ratio have to be more specific. Correct the -- on drinks. So you have to you have here a dinosaur. Sixty million years before T Rex which is essentially just kind of relations were down if you go back in time to 1100 of the size that he Rex became. The thing weighed about a 175 pounds to do so is very much at little human sized diamonds or running and running around there. Long -- that's really so. Right like I guess the main. This that the main point of this discovery is that I guess was believed for a long time that perhaps he Rex is. Under developed arms as they as they were thought to be. Served a purpose in one of its earlier manifestations. Are we went to some sort of metamorphosis -- great -- great change on where the other. Where is apparently no it this is how it. This is Howard wise this is how this says this animal it. I always had these these these small arms in the two and two claws at the end that's our season. You know that's how was sixty million your expert here."

" Yeah what's what's really interesting about this and I'm not sure that there's any other example of this in nature is how scalable. This body plan was this -- DT Rex is just a much bigger version of raptor X the only differences. Really relate specifically to just getting bigger. There was there wouldn't really know what a fundamental differences which is interest in this body Clinton was so scalable. On and yet I did still had the really tiny -- that is interesting is you'd think that the reason for the tiny arms is if you want to balance your tail and your head. And you wanna put as much of the weight in your head as possible. -- you have the biggest draws possible indeed arms need to shrink right. It's it's zero sum game and there. It is CNET that the creature so small had the same proportions if you think that that really had to that would really be a function of overall. -- body size but he didn't."

" I wish that it -- it was even more scalable because I want a little pockets you wreck that and he. The past it's a tiny thing tiny."

" Does that mean based on this new information that maybe. Even thirty million years say prior to that 155 million years ago. Maybe there is a smaller. Classes of T -- her dinosaur in the Stanley to be found something that was actually smaller and nano Rex -- Iraq's. Path at. If you find it but you can call a."

" And beverage here then than today we would have you know an enormous. -- size to relax. Me we definitely announce."

" Okay T thing happen in Iraq that's kind of reset it hit the reset button at the it that affected the -- courtesy of some random. Factoid just entered my head I remember reading that T -- arms you know you might to get them and his floppy little useless things but I -- read that they were. Pretty beefy and at least in human terms somebody calculated some scientists determined somehow that. The the T -- would be able to curl 200 pounds. It is -- that it still waves Russia and teach it. And I -- advocates now."

" friends and it's."

" Let's quarter the next item which is about. Bill -- good film are -- dumb are about the -- don't know about bill that the -- them."

" I see imminent very schizophrenic and a well multiple personality disorder by now he's human and he's got this good qualities as bad quality yeah."

" There have been a big fan has but that case I don't really agree it's adamant that we recovered from but I think. So the -- a political into -- effort to substance to what are we talking about. Omar they're tired of bill Mara mine resistant. Welcome the skeptics. -- there has been and his that this is most favorite show is politically incorrect. And he is it comedian who deals with political issues social issues and as candidate faced reputation. He also is a very outspoken. On the history as a non believer. Although it's not really clear exactly. But his metaphysical beliefs are he certainly. He certainly does not accept any. Major organized religion and -- recently he produced the movie religion lists which was very critical of organized for the this has certainly had endeared him to the however the flip side of bill -- it's especially. Around issues. Of science and medicine. The -- a -- correct and which leads to a lot of speculation and -- in consternation you know what do we reconcile. These two things and and I think. People come to different conclusions about them my sense is always been that the president ideologue. And -- not really irrational list and certainly. I'm not a science currently that he will take views. That fit his ideology and I think that when people like. The use of -- that he takes you then you can like him when you don't then you still happening of those views it's a rational."

" And I mention another thing that induce him to skeptics is that. When the 9/11 true -- had their heyday he smacks then down we run out. Without even blinking."

" Now it was absolutely against the the truth there's. But let's get it to his stance on alternative medicine this came up he was it. Our last week are on his current show real time with film are the topic of alternative medicine came up these silly question. I guess it's writing questions from ST think. That -- nationalize health -- United States who would be good or bad for alternative medicine. And that prompted him to launch in Q1 of his typical. Grants where he essentially said. That -- the one of the guests brought up the the end the question. -- prescribing late wolf war. Cancer -- truly is is a quack treatment that was proven to be an effective -- the 1970s. -- but it survived after that is a Vietnam simply fraudulent treatment it and -- To lower cancer patients to clinics in Mexico and take their money before they -- So -- if you want at one point that he went off on was that. It's illegal. To practice or even talk about. Alternative medicine in the United States which is just utter certainty yes this is complete BS. He's and he and he has justification for that was that the pharmaceutical industry has its tentacles wrapped around the United States government to such -- That -- its of its department -- the evil pharmaceutical industry that is Miki even talking about alternative medicine let alone trying to practice it. Quarter quote illegal that's what he sent. Utter BS in fact frustrating only -- ridiculously difficult. To keep. Cancer quacks from. Killing people with fraudulent therapies we we talked last week during our live show about called the Clark. Who you live to ripe old age selling her fraudulent therapies. We talked about the Gonzales treatment which has always been implausible and never really had the evidence to show that it worked and now a recent study showed that in fact. Patients on the Gonzales therapy. Did probably no better then and -- for pancreatic came to him being -- while the standard therapy group live three times as long and yet. -- been you've been totally unable to shut him down he's happily practicing his cancer quackery. You know."

" I wonder if if -- recognizes well obviously doesn't. Mean it's -- in the irony that Meyer. So opposes religion. But doesn't see the parallels between. Fundamentalists you like to claim that it's illegal for students to have bibles in school that it's illegal for students to pray in school. These patently false claims that they -- just to drum up sympathy. And it's the exact same sort of thing until didn't go to talk about. Alternate medicine now it's not."

" Action thing right -- no way I can reconcile those two things that he has anti religious stances not fundamentally based international estimates that house because. As you say the cognitive dissonance would just be too great. On the hypocrisy it's just as it would be just astounding he got it got -- it gets worse from there is then he set the he was challenged. By saying that you will would he think it. That it should be illegal to to which probably true and he said well I don't know of lay told works or not which again yes we know it doesn't work. But but I know that the crap that western medicine has been doing for the last fifty years doesn't work. -- done nothing we've done nothing. To treat cancer and he's over the rainbow on this one imports. Yeah he's really out of it's totally out of touch doubt that we just spoke a few weeks ago there was a side to fiction -- this does data is out there. Looking at cancer survival over the last fifty years which has been steadily increasing. It's been slowly steadily improving in fact for the youngest age groups. The cancer. Deaths have decreased 25 point 9% per decade and in the oldest groups of people and it worked for cancer. Cancer deaths have been declining at six point 8% per decade. For some individual cancers. You -- I knew what was an almost automatic death sentence fifty years ago. We now almost always cure there are some other it's like pancreatic cancer for example we -- made only incremental gains it still. You know very factory very severe illness and cancer is what diseases the category of disease -- all together. But there's the data that data is absolutely objective. Cancer survival is improving. Stent slowly and steadily with advances in science based medicine -- science and scientific medicine. Which he denigrates as western medicine that has been steadily improving. Cancer -- meanwhile he says what he also claims that people go out of the country. To get the illegal you know cancer therapies and even though they were given a death sentence they come back alive. So current about a month the acrid bitter about that you need to eat well where's the evidence that there's so you use some clinics outside unity to have cured cancer. And."

" Yeah and also there's -- there's that same -- argument about I mean the idea that doctors are at their handing out death sentence it is. So misleading because we've we've discussed this in the past about how a doctor will not say. You have you weeks -- that. Go you know his children. It's writes more you know this is what most people --"

" From this disease you know this is -- likely window but you might survive at this -- you might activist."

" It's a range. So when people get a quote unquote -- Sutton it's totally possible that they could outlive."

" What most people. It's a worry about what other people -- yes okay."

" Gonna be on the far into the current -- you know our mission spontaneous remission you know there's there's there's there's some some -- have a long tail as we call it. And and you could survive a lot longer than the media -- the average absolutely make Stephen. A big bill -- is making this stuff up out of whole -- actually think he's reading a lot of really bad. Blogs articles -- he's getting his information from -- he's buying a whole cloth guide to say he's spouting the absolute worst of the worst anti scientific. You know pro pro alternative medicine propagate. There's no other way to -- he finishes up by saying. That the whole -- but quarter of quote western medical system is corrupt that it only treats symptoms. And it does that because it's a scam that's designed to keep people sick. -- Steve we've been hearing this for decades the same old stuff. It writes that we don't which is it's just factually wrong it factually wrong that we. You somehow deliberately only treat symptoms. That's not cents. Of course we always go for the therapeutic effect of the justice and dramatic -- whenever one is available it's just. It's completely buried in this guy actually happening this guy -- won a science award."

" All -- now you bring me to the final thing that I wanted to bring up witches and this is prepared you know the huge controversy comes in. Is that the atheist alliance international. Is giving bill -- the Richard Dawkins award are now if this word just. An award for his movie relate to lists or -- was just for somebody promoting. You and a non believer you know -- way of life although at the thought all those things to be perfectly fine it's there organizations there -- who cares but the thing that. As has ruffled a few senators is that in the criteria for the award. It specifically says. One of the criteria is the advancement of science. -- the word to shine so it's it's facilities as who -- writing media at the art film and or state advocates increased scientific knowledge. Phil -- advocating for scientific literacy within medicine. On and going beyond just this one you know -- that he -- on the show we speed -- you know flirting with germ theory denial he's an anti vaccination -- to. Did they wanted to do well before giving him and so war I mean. And that's really stunning it's really -- and -- thorough and other word to better suit that Steve. You know some of my colleagues have you contacted Richard Dawkins. To say to do you -- that the award that bears your name is being given to somebody with these rather flagrant anti scientific. The news for similar to use that you yourself have lambasted in your writing and shows. At least -- and he essentially said. To -- bill Mars is a good atheist and I don't know anything about his medical news. Yeah that's I have this hot out that yeah I love Richard Dawkins he's an intellectual hero of mine. You know I'm looking forward to reading his latest book awesome guy put it this is a fail in book it's hard to get a pass on this. I've observed others this is the praying that things that drives wedges between the atheists and skeptical community."

" All coming yeah I think -- better. Amongst atheists and skeptics it's. It's difficult to find mainstream heroes that you can look up to and who are out there are making -- different so."

" When you find line blank though -- And promote -- atheist and and one. Respect and also permitting. For instance slapping down the 9/11 truth there is. People want to award and they wanna associate with and in the hopes that. You know the dance. Community the movement of -- but."

" Yeah I mean I I think that."

" People live. Let that get in the way of responsibly. Looking at what he's done and what he stands or again the got a little bit bigger picture is Steve or. Oracle order really good blog and wellness. -- absolutely so and and to he's been tracking the bill Mars shenanigans for years actually used. Or Rex. A blog posts and -- my primary source for this factual information. If you because if you wanna -- a sushi and read everything -- respectfully that it respectful insolent. Just look up on -- plotting. More about it. Our schedule more quick news item could -- do have a long interview coming up so Rebecca you're gonna tell us about the -- monster. I."

" I am. We once again have a crypt zoological. Creature that has biologists -- just baffled."

" But I do -- with excess or not really."

" At this story goes that in Panama. Any creature crawled out of the water. Canada out of the cave. -- stream. And sound teenagers saw it and were freaked out because it was all naked and -- and weird though keen and so they threw stones at it he."

" It was just that you know obviously. A little negative hanging right to suppress human right alerts right thing it's it's definitely aren't ready it's good and I'm the click as -- Simpson that was flat what is that killers -- yet or pick it up I. It's fun especially -- you. And that."

" This story as told -- actually. Kind of sad would you look at it on the -- yet that these are humans."

" Yeah it's a little suspicious so they. They supposedly killed -- spring and early in the stream. And then apparently at some or any."

" They drag it back how and needed now on Iraq or someone laid down rocks as as the pictures we have -- it -- Dow. On the rocks with its arms there -- any Orleans. Kimbo and a big."

" Pot belly and then like."

" Little -- Tom Lothian out of it's about yeah it's quite at. And so this ran on the news. -- A big mystery and quickly hit the enter wed kind of like. The Montauk monster of glass on her. It is certainly looked similar because -- New TV and president of the water it's dead this is. Ireland's."

" But it's a good thing is."

" Zoologist were not in fact baffled and many of them die it's exactly what this was with in hours -- appearing on line I have to say it would ever saw the picture to all three seconds to figure out what it. But yeah I I do agree that we have a lot of links."

" To this sent drew as you. Conduct has a skeptic -- I held off post it because."

" My one line. Was going to be it's it's locked -- means that -- that I was waiting for an actual professional way in. And sure enough over on and and the science blog."

" Catcher pods duality. Daryn -- posted. Yeah and it's the law. Even pointed out. As -- added it is that the."

" Bottom that the creature. It's not completely stripped it here there's actually error near the bottom -- Indicated that media had."

" Some disease or that the hair is just stripped away votes in the water. And he includes pictures and I mean it's it's obvious that."

" Evidently the giveaway what it was the clock and you know -- that -- clawed. Fingers -- Patrice Claus -- that's thickening. -- of the hang upside down from I thought it was a yet is that redneck when efforts."

" There is that there isn't. Another photo that that shows the body more decomposed. And that really makes the clause. --"

" Now timed it. The death of the creatures such that the story of the rocks during teenagers is probably --"

" Well I mean of rock during teenagers they're are sketchy on entry level yeah that lake."

" YA first of all why did you hit it with rock why did you throw it in the water why did you pull it back now. And then yeah they YYE. By."

" At a and a it's gonna analyze and and I can export what they did. This is becoming a fun game though that you know -- crypt as you'll want to creature what does that really you know. Yeah out that the Montauk monster it was a raccoon figured that this thing was the trees Buffett took a fun little game -- across this."

" Well Ireland this one took -- seconds and actually on that touch iPods he -- about it being sloth."

" So -- a really funny comment saying that they're son is six years old and took four seconds to look at Canada. It's a slot. And then this sad to follow up with that this group of and then. My -- and it's a sad about it that he went drew a picture of him hockey net loss of articulates. That. At least the Montauk on. Remind listeners mind on -- and they weren't that. Oh lead back some -- washed out."

" Last year and it looked like Iraq and the district in but it was very odd. And."

" Nobody really like your when it happened that -- until a full year later this past. So when revealed that they were responsible or it was just some people on the beach found -- dead raccoon. Put it on a -- and setting on fire isn't quite."

" And eventually the parents brought it around to where it was found and they had pictures to back up there. Whacked out story says he's like that what had a really nice twist to it and it went on for a full year this one nearly thirty seconds into. Of scary now configured. -- in the bottom I think the bottom line is that decomposing and cool yeah it. -- consent and sad you know what it what angle we didn't actually consider here is that and that thing was making its way. Out of the water it could have actually been a zombie. Facade on blah blah yeah. Yeah that's true I -- can consider that a yes mr. I would zombies loss even slower than regulars on the removal almost backwards in time yes I think that. So what slower than zombies club. And evidently a large -- if you bet I guess now that. Well let's go on with our interview."

" Yeah yeah."

" We are joined now about it Michael that's -- Michael welcome to the skeptics guide. And yes I -- nice to speak you -- could be your."

" And Michael is the president of the singularity institute for artificial intelligence. And you are widely published on futurist outcome -- really -- dot net. The nine year also involved with the lifeboat foundation website you've published errors while. And you we're talking TJ because in our next weekend. The week after this podcast comes out. Is a conference call the singularity summit can you tell us about that."

" Okay. This singularity institute -- an annual -- the singularity summit we have the first one in 2006. It has health had a great number of prominent speakers over the years including post editor of end to Rodney Brooks Peter nor big. This she TO for Intel old Justin -- And don't this year we're going to have breakthroughs loyal and already crazy. David Chalmers. Stephen Wolf rom and a number of other pretty -- Clinton's. It's also the first year it's gonna be on the east coaster. Yet this is the first I can tell the first -- any offense to a totally -- short it's been on the east coast. They've been broken and humanist association. -- previously on the east coast though. But those have been on a much smaller scale and they've been you know somewhat less formal Borland conference in dial."

" So just for -- this'll be October 3 and fourth 2009 in New York City. And you can get all the information at singularity summit dot com. Are there are still tickets available people --"

" we still tickets available would have been ninety thinking through boring it's possible to purchased tickets for -- approached staged. The -- first day he is a lot more focused on technology. And the second day he's more focused on institutions. The future of science prediction etc."

" So we've talked about the singularity are on our podcast before. The one to -- he -- how would you give us and he capsule is summary of what is the singularity --"

" To meet the critical -- concept of the Cingular the instead of precursor of self improvement. That we can use intelligence to understand intelligence and to make it more effective -- individually or collectively. Or true or trail -- it into machines. This is the case. And if we are fairly near to some fundamental breakthroughs in our ability to increase -- through individual intelligence through. Biotechnologies to various sorts. Or collective intelligence with the Internet and related and better understanding of social peace to -- better understanding of the threat to -- it's over. Or. Obviously the most important threshold. Understanding. Have to think well enough to keep to rock to think. Which is what they -- helped arm. So far we came to the lightning and -- the attention to give your mistress. You know it's in place for the most part that we -- the lightning into tend to think -- we're making continual progress in understanding what thinking -- and you really need to understand what things mean. At a deep fundamental level without and -- and what it. If you're going to keep -- to -- Nonetheless the things -- there -- a lot of progress coming in that for direction from a lot of different trunks. -- understanding of the brain to understanding of revolutionary dynamic understanding of machine learning to general are used to. -- technology generalized philosophy of aliens and this agreement extending what could mean for something to reference something against. It does look to most people look at it pretty hard like it would be very surprising if there was not. A fundamental threshold crossed during the 21 century. And between -- being able group. -- ultimately understanding talk and ultimately understanding it or. Understanding the things that is made of well enough to build and even if you can't quite understand. And you can understand don't know -- aren't without necessarily understanding brains. And if you put a bunch torrent together. You've got a brand if you you know if you know Heather wired together and put them together you've got to bring your computer to understand --"

" Right so we could duplicate. The the structure and function of -- even if we don't quite understand. Exactly how it's functioning that the mind would then be an emergent phenomenon that would that would arise out of it. Even though we didn't specifically. -- to plan for a to a rise but it it it would come out of it. That's kind of the idea."

" It seems very unlikely that in mind were to life without planning for my mind tour learn. The plant can lead to buy it without us. Fully appreciating exactly what it would be put their price -- and extending it. And most importantly without us being able to dictate its preferences. We can be very anthropomorphic queen normally assume that -- have to be like us but of course they don't."

" Well we don't even know necessarily what it. When it means for in mind to be human you know we have many other examples to comparison again."

" Correct so we have a lot of bombed killing ephedra has worked more of the jury ever. Reliable and tips if you're just nice enough to the fundamentally evil creature of it will have to look you."

" Right. At PepsiCo and like this to skip a world bobsled is actually I I I I do not think that -- emerge out of just having enough neurons. With you in silicon or whatever. And then hooking up together in functioning. There's definitely not just from having enough Huber -- let them together what. Yeah an and that that's the key the right way and a and that's still what we're trying to -- that -- parts of the cortex coaches in the cerebellum. Conscious. The -- old houses as many errands. And in -- connections as the cortex. But it doesn't produce anything that we can measure experience is consciousness."

" Aren't there many aspects of mine that would that would. Not necessarily be planned for that that a rise that just because you've reached a critical threshold. Of complexity. Out of ideas behaviors and and aspects. A rise out of it that -- simple answer that question and third thing is no actually -- that it doesn't because some otherwise we would all be dead by now. We already have enough computing power. Two and global Internet is at this point. More complex by most reasonable measures then the brain. So -- what you're saying is that sky net is not gonna spontaneously become self away. Like I know it's not going to spontaneously become self aware and held. That isn't the same thing that you won't have a spontaneous. Surprising for -- source -- for threshold. A mole we begin the system which is already intelligent. And right between that when needed. Intelligent but. Not self that's self aware say no well I -- to chocolate -- wherever -- is not helpful where okay here here's what we're talking about. Right now. If I want to win them in the game of chess like best strategy is probably to think really -- about the next move and then about the group after. But if I want to win against Castro doubled. If I want to have any hope in this game against Castro -- going to have to spend much time learning to be better it chest before I play him. Yes. -- L really for the world wherever delegates forms of self improvement too often that the best way to accomplish won't through a major role. But our everyday trivial gold they're very very open best served. That given human level of self understanding. Bali self modification. What do you mean by that I mean there. For most tasks that I went to accomplish with the retreating myself or getting to work in the morning turning on the computer. Taking a share or brushing my teeth. It's very likely the case that the -- was a lot smarter. I could do a better job -- the staff asks. But it's more efficient for me to just do that task rather than trying to figure out -- to be smarter said that I'll be able to go to -- a way -- on the other hand. If I want to stroll. Beautiful like quantum mechanics with general relativity. Can through plausible that the most direct way for me to do so with the most efficient the shortest path to unification. Might be learning have to think that. That's a full chairman of delightful both self. Control and self awareness and gifted degree twitch unable to modify. The systems that make up my mind the degree -- and able to observe them that said. If Ali -- head in much better ability to look at the components of mind and what they were doing. Observe them and understand how they've worked to Britain when they went wrong when they were twelve. -- implied it worked and to develop new more efficient system for doing the same things. Then it seems fairly likely that if Claiborne kids to not just unify physics. But to do well in the interview. You know produce a positive impression in this interview the best way to do so like."

" But are you talking essentially what this leading to is. Artificial intelligence. And Hawaii that's going to create. This in the court record singularity -- across this tipping point because right now I can't. You to rewire my brain to make it function better for a specific task but it. You know it's it's plausible that artificially intelligent. Machine could it actually in fact re programmer rewire itself. To function better. So put it on a completely different path."

" Yes that's my point that there there is although there's no point where machines will wake up going from nine countries to countries merely by crushing complexity for short. There at the point of self understanding. And excellent -- own internal organs. -- True the drafted he crossed the threshold. Former. Potentially. Becoming. Fully human perspective all powerful. Being the simplest way to accomplish any different goal."

" Right who's doing the artificially intelligent creature -- to the conclusion that in order to accomplish its task it has to improve itself. Right and at that would be precursors. To the self reinforcing process."

" Assuming it -- itself in ways that further increased its ability to improve itself which would have been. If -- improvement would drawing. On a general understanding appalling that general understanding of -- Influential processes work. Children."

" So -- got that much about occurs wheels. Position in the singularity I totally -- the he's actually on the something in terms that is of fundamental property of information. In that. It builds upon itself."

" Well it. I won't point out that this is not actually Chris -- Patricia. This is the singular idea -- is your position but crude oil does not in his books focus. All in the self improving they are passing threshold he talks about how. -- fairly continuous process of it up or -- change where. Up -- it's -- direct financial. But he's not focused. In aware of new tools make people better at making new and exciting and new tools. Richest. -- we called soft take off the shelf slope. Although I definitely think that new tools we'll make people better at thinking and has been doing so for hundreds of Beers and he's correct about that. And although -- half of the singularity summit will be focused on that. You know many people will be talking about helps new tools for coordination. -- to fight the good that the future of the scientific meant dead. Ultimately to reason why were putting all of these. Is that we are concerned about the plug tickle the -- between the -- Record yourself recruitment. And not only which is really not sort of personal books."

" Right although he does talk about it to some agreement in the the singularity is nearing -- the one we're primarily talks about it yeah I agree he's CE keys. Did trying to develop a concept that it is generic to just any any information based technology. Where essentially you're focusing more on. Actual self improving AI is that the distinction trying."

" Well let's not think -- from -- Let's just say there corrosive self improvement because. This -- without consciousness. Yes and then possibly with with or without consciousness. And with over their -- I mean this could in principle be done by some -- elaborate bio technological threatened. I shoot it right no I don't I don't take Stewart him ropes BV of quantum consciousness in Madrid to -- SpinRite is still. But if you correct and you need likely to be -- At some point and they'll wait 21 century I would expect it to have. Julien to delicately manipulated by and bind and a steel machinery. Netbooks have like for two fields. Rearranging themselves. Understanding hell would be quantum coherence works with the networks and building -- true and more elaborate networks reporting -- You know and there would be some point where -- Best way for the micro -- networks. To buy hamburger. -- to love. Director robot to walk down the street to the McDonald's and pink -- hamburger. And then there would be some later point in their development for the best way for the maker -- network to buy it hamburger. Bush -- Clinton vacuum and we eventually you're the first. In though and any album in the hamburgers that wouldn't be a good thing Michael no no that would not be this is. Basically as they say the reason for having these -- It'll look like -- full. Forty it looks like give me an arbitrary goal is in fact steadily. Because by default -- Or. Ultimately their preferences. And if we set of preferences. Uniquely designates. One desired state for the universe has optimal. And if you don't mind that. Sufficiently powerful to be essentially unchecked authority. Any other system in the world. Then it's going to -- or -- out of commander. Of the universe it's still fairly close approximation. To the perfect can -- creation of that preference function. And that -- function can be completely arbitrary. It doesn't really matter what it is but for any given ignored expert for -- function is very unlikely. That it includes arts and."

" Is it is it not worth it that the needs to try to nudge this. Early AI intuit intuit is disarm -- configuration where we are -- where we could continue to -- co exist with it. -- you're making it sound like it's. It's uncontrollable and that oh in just terribly terribly difficult to control. But it but it is a prime concern that we that we should be talking about because that tonight. Could -- pretty nasty if we don't take and consideration."

" Like. It as far as I can tell. If not the most difficult problem mankind ever been faced with. It at least in the top three your four. It's a problem -- to some degree we've been working on war. 3000 years -- what do we want problem so Michael to kind of summarizes because -- you know listening to you in and night. Realize early on in our conversation and you -- such a profoundly. A more advance understanding of all this and I do and I have to kind of reduce it down to understandable bits war from what I'm gathering what you're saying. As as our computer technology advances and as we develop more more complex. Hardware software. And along with that artificial intelligence of some sort. Along with that we have to we have such a tremendously huge responsibility to to this development that we have to. Understand it in such a way as if that so as it does packet out of our control right to vote their thirst so what has it. Doesn't do anything other than what we want you to do. A -- and very very careful reflection for what we -- At which you also say that this is. Regardless of he -- here now people saying oh -- we shouldn't do this at all that -- and sometimes and I talked to people and they they had they throw up these big concrete walls of we shouldn't be developing in with this or this or doing you know doing research in these things because it. The potential dangers danger and it. Would you say no matter what happens. It's inevitable that we're gonna."

" Get in this position. Assuming that we make it means just not just human you're human species mix it. But then we the human species -- and we continue to have scientific progress. In over the 21 century it -- less debate where we had it during the twentieth century you're greater. Yes I can't imagine a world. Is different from today -- today is from 190 million or really even from as different from today is today it's from 1939. That you didn't have some sort of precocious self improvement. Threshold being -- It seems to me that we would have to have some sort of a daily work and -- Effort not to develop. In increasingly. Broad category set of technologies. Or. Have some accidental general failure. A flaw or trying to for progress in order to not have formed. Because of self improvement event take place during the 21 century that doesn't give us a terribly great demand turned it doesn't give us terribly little unlike."

" Your your question is how do we handle. AI. How to -- how to recreate it in and handle it in such a way as. It it's a benefit to humanity and not -- hazard and doing it this fundamental philosophy yes well a fundamental science which is why it's particularly difficult. The article -- take Michael did you say that you used tickets reasonable to say. That you guys could possibly come come up with a conclusion in the within the next ten years of how to handle it. Possibly even we could possibly even create that that's over. Ultimately trying to do it doesn't mean that we'll succeed or early that we have a very good chance of success but I do think relative to be caught you know it's it's phenomenally. Worthwhile. Thing to try to do."

" I mean back up a little bit so these are they talking about how -- we keep a neat. Artificial intelligent voters of self freak re person improving technology. From essentially taking over the world and deciding that humanities are relevant terms. Then they would rather have a universe were were not -- beware word batteries sleeves or whatever race. -- it's -- so what 11 way that I think you've been focusing on so far is the the the quote unquote laws of robotics approach the Asimov for -- we. Yeah volatile in the broadest -- that you can strain the artificial intelligence -- underway in new networking strain he got. But he can't constrain it then how can you keep it from. Deciding that we're relevant that some you don't."

" too constrained something that you're creating if you create something you get to designate all of it. Preferences. If you merely just tried to do. What you don't think where it was stumbling out semantics thing could let me know -- the rain we're we're completely enough we've had a whole media campaign called we always bad but I can 2000 funny."

" Uh huh go I was and I didn't mean to refer specifically to the three laws so much talent overall -- so upset. No constraint in the most general dentist who knows how much trying to understand because essentially were saying we want the AI. To beat benign -- to take a broad concept anomaly right. So we -- trying to close down certain paths -- which it might develop or improve itself to eliminate those pads that will lead to a malignant --"

" You don't need to close down any thing you don't need to eliminate anything. We -- creating. VA and everything ability to. We get to -- at at the creators this is not like it trying to hold regularly and that had instinct an important. It's eighty machine is incredibly hard not to anthropomorphic aren't -- There's really very little hope of managing it but don't we are creating -- and therefore where designating every feet -- that that of the fifth. Creating yet to want to destroy it and then constraining it to that it doesn't -- yourself is the -- the very bad way of doing."

" That's what I'm talking about the -- further clarified because your cedar we're talking of a two different things are talking about creating it in a certain form. But I'm talking about once he gets the point where than it starts recreating itself. We have to constrain the ways in which it might create and -- itself so that it doesn't lead to. Something that he wants to destroy is obviously we're not gonna creates -- wants to destroy it and keep it from doing so we're just pointed we're gonna create something that. Who will be initially maybe its initial state may be benign but since you're talking about recurrence of self improvement. We have to also keep it from you meet evolving into something elected that's what I mean by constraining it."

" If we're talking about a single. Knocked in economy or an ecosystem. If we're not talking that something didn't vote rendered that. We're not talking about some. Thing that you need from a human. Changes in course to not count -- improvement. Changes in goals or necessarily. Accidents or compromise. But he unchecked on constrained -- that want to ice cream. We'll never however -- to become discard that it once chocolate candy and --"

" But it could decide that the best way to make ice cream -- human brains. Light to -- only destroyed that the best way to make a screen. Is that you can -- Right that's what I'm talking about. So I -- we keep it from deciding that it wants to make as human brains which is kind of a silly analogy to arrive at but I don't know that experience."

" How do we do so we K -- including institute approach has always been. That we have to make it once to create human in the value and to create human value ahead of him in -- that's okay. But human value is not an easy thing for human toll cabal would explore and in fact it's only going to be able to create human W. With all probability by looking -- human for."

" Did you meet you mean that it will value on life etc. no I mean it will tell you what if we're pleased that humans buried. Okay but in a way isn't that kind of you know laws of robotics ish as a mafia and this I think is the opposite of."

" Wasn't about to finish him off as a laughs perspective as -- approach assumes some natural -- To dominate to rule that it is assumes that not true that human value the human preferences. Human ego. Life is out of the neat tour of consciousness. Like Q in. Inject. -- of consciousness into your public funded network. And that -- of consciousness includes. The desire for dominance. And then you inject into your project on the network. A bomb checks or that you're putting and -- some complexity. And then your. You're putting in consciousness and consciousness of the films can't sort of complexity that consciousness does not plausibly have. And then having putting in consciousness you need to put in that accident complexity. But really seem. You never put in the desire to -- You whatever desires daily hand it has because Hugh implicitly or explicitly put them in. So Google. Always."

" Too -- middle that's that's assuming a level of can a certain level control. I would think that these systems that -- going to building we would be developing systems that would be developing on top of systems on top of systems so there wouldn't be like. A human sitting there having like this very detailed understanding about how the thing works you're saying it seems to me that we cannot understand complex instant. And I agree. And if we can't understand complex system and we have to build -- system and not complex weren't there's no reason intelligence can't be complex. Are okay."

" So so we get there he switched gears a little bit so one solution is. Just to create. A guy you know however you want to characterizes that -- desire to fishery humanity. But another another possible way of keeping. The robot apocalypse from happening is -- is to put it in a box meaning that sure we might have. And you know artificial intelligence system that even can design ways to improve itself. But it still doesn't have its finger on the -- that we don't give it it'll put it in a robot body war. In factory or an machine worry can actually effect the outside world. It's just in a box somewhere so we can only affect the outside world through humans so we Europe were we are built in fails -- what what do you think about that."

" Well a lot of people think that should be -- second and shift and and in make some sense to me that it should be a second line of defense in the best of all possible worlds were given limited resource your designer -- Though but first it doesn't solve the problem if you make an -- that he is unable to change the world greatly. If you considering that -- that it came to then you're just putting off the problem until the next person creates an -- that can't. And the world critically show alternately -- is the only long term solution you'll need to show my true we free to act ARU. That camera. Protect the world from the next guy who doesn't get tripped up."

" Eventually some mad men will put it in robust. And yet to deal with that."

" Second. When we talk about putting inalienable. If we're talking about ordinarily -- that's intelligent than humans. Their teens to -- except that. And even -- ventricular that we both intelligent and human fashioning. Can be wonderful scientific and for but such nail it doesn't need to be put in -- If we're talking about something. Well the key to bring more intelligent than humans. And also with qualitatively different relationship to information. Then the metaphor that I think coach is. Even at the end of the episode that diapers doesn't hold a practical for all these -- the quality all you know he's locked in between filled rift. All sorts of advanced electronic equipment there's no way you'll -- will be able. And instead changed of some sort. It is in principle possible to build a physical and initiation. Which doesn't interface with the outside world. But our conception of robot eve. -- into the act with their third road you don't need their hand and links. You. Being smug little more powerful than having him to lay -- or I think of building and AI pumped. As sort of like. Mentally retarded five year old who -- visual court fees and elect the concept of vision. Trying to design a pretend that will hold a -- genius humid in this -- and the format for. Via without having ever seen and -- to fill in for prison before without -- having ever been any record of anyone. Imprisoning anyone before so basically what you're saying is don't give them access to the Internet. I think that's. Don't give them access to deal a troubling -- bankrupt. It gives an answer to their own to their old the physical and -- issue of their -- or don't give them access to electricity. Space time. Yet so Michael we have to do this for our own technology but. On eight universe scale we also have to hope that every other intelligent species out there. -- is doing this with very. The university. We have gift -- to protect us and general relativity does look pretty likely. To Julio super woman or triple absolutely. And for a yeah."

" That's true however you that does get back to rush to get the the person's name was attached to this but. If just one. Intelligent technological civilization -- there. Their robots cannot control. Now we essentially have a machine a guy civilization. Why have been too self replicating exploring. Machines from. As it technological civilization all ready arrived. Here. This is and this is a massive speculation so need to you can really draw presumably an intelligent belief is that there are well that's one of the conclusions may be it's rare that -- grows into the -- is that maybe they're already here they are here and it does not malignant war. As you say distance since really is very protective and we're just protected by the sheer size of the universe. What one last thing in terms of how we protect ourselves. We could merge with the AI rights that we got little help. Is so that I don't know like I said. Would that help or are we just creating a budget document and that don't care of humanity will take over the world anyway."

" I'm what you can you don't need to create a bunch you don't need to create one. You only need one system that that it's because simply shelf improved. You know just like life created. Millions and millions of species. That only one of them built to civilization and decided to essentially what it'll -- other. -- diversity. Doesn't help in when. Self enhancement to the possibility. So. Nick both -- hasn't it record the future of human evolution. Which I'm very strongly recommend. Rich I think. I could symbolize this thing this is a big part of why that doesn't help put doesn't help very much. On the overhead and largely we have this whole problem because we're job. We have this problem now because we knew little monkey brains with the tiny bit of extra cortex Ecuadoran. I just barely smart enough to create machine launch. And early questionable is smart enough to figure out what we want -- to do. I mean it seems very plausible that even moderate improvement in human reasoning ability. Would solve our problems. -- allowing -- to well not screw up. But we won't solve our problems Bali having a base. By merging the machines and having a race to develop things first without without --"

" Well Michael it's like we could talk about this for hours. But that be -- getting to the universe time. Outward looking for some it was going to be able to make the the singularity summit and will probably has some reports. Back from that's where we're looking forward -- that and we really appreciate it can attempt to come on our show pensioners thoughts."

" I'm glad to have spoken here come. Basically think of thirty summit is trying to present day wider range of views only future oriented drinkers were acquainted -- these ideas. They may not -- bulge in general terribly -- with myself workers -- the most of them will tend to think. Then -- some sort of radical acceleration and scientific changes likely in the next century -- we're. Bringing in people from fourth to feed from these -- quantum computing. -- whole wide variety of -- advance. Seem like they may have relevant. A born again im liking or plaintiffs to end. Basically they'll be presented in different positions to the public available -- their thinking on the subject is today. I appreciate you're giving me the telling and unlike so many people will be interested in the singularly committed to basically. Step number forward in determining the future of the universe so thanks again Michael in --"

" You are right. It's time to shine through oral."

" Each week I come up with three sides used items for facts and feel and one day. And that channels red analyst at instantly which one is to take it -- ready for this week and that's also readying. I'd never -- any new study finds that use of texting so called chat speak is significantly correlated with poor spelling ability and students. Our number two -- new research finds that mortality rates increased by 6% in UK hospitals in the first week of August when you doctors beacon training. And -- three meta analysis finds that community smoking bans decreased heart attack emissions by 36%. At three years. Take a first."

" So we. The first one is new study that finds that texting. Is making kids spell poorly. I agree with that I agree with that because it's done that to me absolutely. The dollar spoke the word later. You don't want L eight. G-8. Session -- the that you are there we all do it we don't do it I think it affects. Pretty much most of us that that like to text a lot in. Use abbreviations and get in the report. Is their research set finds that mortality rates increase when new doctors begin their training the first week. -- you know Steve what do you think about that and a -- a practical lot of things about it. Okay you don't have to struggle. Outside perspective I'd say sure that make sense -- doctors c'mon there's more confusion in the hospital there being pushed to do work. They don't have obviously don't have the experience of the reflexes to it to him a lot of the stuff wouldn't only be a week. I don't know with I don't know if they'd learn everything in a week that that would you know make those percentages go away by an it's an interesting idea. That's somebody that's a British tracking just I don't think I -- so it's not right about this to be one way or the other. And the last one. That a ban on smoking will indeed reduce heart attacks. That makes a lot of sense. So. I'm gonna go width. The doctors killing people as the fake."

" OK -- So the study about the use texting. Correlating with pork spelling abilities -- students I don't know about this one are. Significantly correlated. Is that scripture here. And I would think that. There are the poor spelling ability as students -- because the more direct correlation with I think how much they read. Rather then. Texting -- speak and so forth some not so sure about that. The other one the next one about mortality rates increase in the 6% in the UK hospitals in August. Yet that strikes me -- correct. Unfortunately. And then the last one which is the meta analysis. About smoking bans decreasing our technicians. That one sounds perfectly like the kind of secretary you would find in a meta analysis study. On my gut is on the -- that -- corrects on the save the one about texting. With pork spelling ability resulting -- spelling ability and students is the fiction. They -- fifth."

" At and I take his -- her -- He -- that yes standings that team would decrease heart attack. And I think that Steve. You are the sort of person."

" Who knowing that I am moving to UK next week -- deliberately seek out a news story that would frighten me."

" Sadly that's true as well lean mean."

" Tech scene. Being -- of course spelling ability as the eight. Fiction interest and obviously there are. I have to go backwards as well he is smoking -- decreasing heart attacks. Have been the arts kind of an obvious may be too obvious beyond that there's this second wind is TI am."

" Mortality rates -- you to new doctors yeah that's that's seems pretty obvious as well get new doctors may be I don't know what the armed. The protocol calls -- particles are over there I don't know if they. -- it's you know make these dot port doctors say I'd go to sleep deprivation as there have been you do you did Steve. On and I think that could also. Potentially have an effect so that -- complete trust those bastards at at a got a -- in that movie quote and so that would sounds reasonable as well to me on the first one. I'm up I'm up by India that chat speak affecting spelling ability as I think a lot of these shortcuts that the kids. That dead texting requires. If they're just so so different from the actual word that you're not they're not gonna confuse him more. Or forget know how to spell you know WTF fully spelled out image -- to get that -- a -- their. I think it's different enough where it's not gonna have an impact on their spelling. Some received that one is fiction."

" The Acura. Okay see you all agree that a meta analysis -- that community smoking bans decreased heart attack him as his maturities at three years. You all think that that -- true and that one is. Science. Long and it does make -- that is the big question would be. It does a ban on smoking like in public places actually decrease overall smoking are people just -- a smoking up when their in their homes. Aren't. The locations does not doing it but. Apparently the effect is quite significant. As he does it decrease smoking but it actually decreases. And admissions for heart attacks -- where you're actually tracking was hostile actions. So that is eighty seems to be worthwhile. Tact to take to reduce smoking and reduce. Morbidity from. Young. Any. -- spoke to -- item item number two. New research finds that mortality rates increased by sixty by 6% in you can hospitals and for -- August when -- doctors in training. And -- you thought that -- fiction Steve bought it and that one -- it is. Science. Are sure Christ's sake if so hurry checked out. But I -- almost -- about the study with that that UK doctors begin their year -- we begin in July. So in US tennis overall the first -- why not embarrass him right away from MI can't deal with that now. Right it really get into the room and it. So. Are -- yup there's obviously reason the obvious reason to think what this disparity might be going on -- you interns and residents -- acts in training who were just taking over you go from. It'll last week of the year where you have the most experienced people. To the first week of the new year we have at least experienced everybody you know moves up and but also for the for the transition. There's more supervision and place rated entities specifically in our program we have supervision that we put in place for the first six weeks of residency. That is not there the rest the year -- sense let me speak. It -- or -- fans want us to think but I don't know what those that don't such measures are universal but. Still coming out there there's a lot more Tesco hospital. In -- line the United States and presumably August in the UK. In that you know it's it's you you yeah you're dealing with a lot of people who are. A functioning at a higher level an -- and are in training so it's because as a ripple effect to quality others more. Consoles because people -- news. Efficient very sure about what they're doing and then that -- everybody -- is that you have to do a lot more work so you doing more work you can -- of the pay less. And attention to each individual patient is. You're spreading out more for example. And while -- supervision is certainly mitigates. Any effect. It's at the end the -- saluted -- less experienced people in the mix so. F not surprised that there's an -- to compare the last week of July the first week of August match for the -- difference. Is that just in the UK that's for the study was done yet but I would not be surprised if you were similar. In the US and Bob does Obama think what you group brought up sleep deprivation. I'm clearly does -- now multiple studies establishing that sleep deprivation correlates with the increased errors. I'm -- insignificant mistakes and has led to. At least in this country a lot of rules. That limiting the number of hours and road residents can work in the number of hours Denise Austin between etc. Armed and that has mitigated that although it you know it's. It has its come with a price because now if you you're breaking up the team the minute her name that. Any individual person in -- call for example in one stretch then you're -- cross covering a lot more so. Whenever our residents not in the hospitals some analysis covering their patients right. So you have to balance. The Atlanta continuity in the cross coverage against them giving people the sleeps that sleep deprived. But also increasing stress also raises Harris. The bottom line is yet if you're in the hospital less. That translates to fewer people being in hospital arrangement parent. Which trip you at least for some of the time which translates into your -- patience when you're on call when you wanna record. Yes so it's it's it's is kind of deserves some game news that the assuming that the number of patients that -- it has to be done the same. And you're not -- can't just say okay we're gonna train twice as many doctors that we have twice as many doctors insist that you can't you can't do that. So it was just sort of moving things around without actually changing. The overall work ratio. So it's that I ever -- remains to be seen if if I think that you'd. And mitigating the sleep deprivation thing was a good thing it was necessary tactic that we had a positive impact but. -- did her -- other problems that came along for the -- all of this means that. A new study finds -- use of texting or so called tech speak is significantly correlated with porous spelling abilities students is complete fiction the -- of course have been the main -- I don't remember that what is being -- that's yeah yeah that's right two months this will be. Herm and in fact what there it wasn't a news a new survey which Ferrer did no correlation so. I -- does not appear to be any negative effect. And it does seem as what like what you said about that it's different enough in fact that people treated almost as if it's a separately yeah. And it may in fact help because. -- you sick about it your your sort of translating words and figuring out a new way. To spell a word used in the fewest number of letters there's a certain amount of skill involved in doing that also translating."

" I think it's going to be at dine and then because I ain't happening magical and and and I just fill in the blanks I or you. Yeah like I type the full where it because it's easier because automatically fills in the where I -- Like you -- eight are that takes for ever but if I type LAT. If fills them. So."

" It's true it's hard to say you know how for how large a purity tyrant. Will -- be this technological window. Where do we will be a need for. I'm hitting the fewest number of keys attitude I always always the yeah it's hard it's hard to say also does things it may take on a life of its own where even it may survive beyond -- specific utility. What we have voice recognition by then being religious and we don't have the text anything anymore. We know. We have I was now we have right. Just -- be people to bad there's very device that they used attacks they can actually call somebody talking they're just even. Sometimes even when you haven't a new technology that may do something better way in which seems to be more convenient way. The older technologies may still persist in certain pitches they still may be better."

" For some things right that those of us who prefer to avoid human interaction yes direct human inaction but situation where you wanna communicate silently. If you wanted to talk to the person you would call them like -- conventions. Or. That -- they don't go in Lebanon for. -- look at the chip to your brain you just think it and it comes up on the a screen that's the ways if you you don't think that everyone will be speaking it in leaked. In the future no one speaking -- now except for more and bulk and that's leak is the name with a language given to. Like basically these Morse to text version of the English language it'll work ethic -- right after -- takes. Set culture is -- predictor of controller so who want to who Lhasa area Taylor okay so are what are we just move on to who's that points. Agreement that he was and I -- haven't played who's that going from two weeks two weeks ago okay here it is. --"

" And he."

" And who was. That wasn't a ferry cerebral who's that noisy and it was a close. And that it is what the brain sounds like when it's interpreting. -- hello yeah no so this is a science in which they turn these brain scans into music and sounds. Now they're able to interpret these brain scans as. We translate translate it into -- if you translated. Converted electrical signals from the brain into. Music tour yet he tones that it would specifically. Fell by an image and the way to Trinity College here in Hartford Connecticut. Identified regions. Of the brain when the become active together and assign each of these groups have different pitch this is what it will come and create software that analysts. So so I was right -- you were right. But as far as our listeners go the one who had it correct was evil lie. He was the first one does not recognize that. Mr. evil has its own doctor evil yeah would -- be mr. aren't there he is evil Kennedy's Asian and it has 10470. Posts. Armitage or else what else -- That's trooper so well done doctor -- What are you after this week and -- right get right to -- showing in last week's news that knows."

" The."

" That's. A man made of stone taking off his stone underwear close. All right so there it is so send in your guess and good luck everyone. I think you have been fascinating as ways. JD ever quote I have a quote Rebecca thank you just jump on my tedium and -- the no no of course he they have fired up about and I are talking earlier but it won't be. It's up to attack in. -- ever quote does Rebecca have a core I actually think out of every one you will appreciate this quote board. Look at the most. I'm not gonna say who's the person isn't gonna say to quote first week were the laughter and then I'll say news quotes are okay. And Oprah. I'm really happy for you haven't let you finish but Jenny McCarthy is one of the biggest in its full time. And Gagne our and I Kanye West. It's -- can't. What do inconsistent and I think actually however that was -- then that was they parity of what actually took place that the and TV musical it's either the MTV music awards that was sent in by Matthew Troy Apple's. Who said he wasn't gonna charge -- for the corporate I had to do it I had to actually let the world know. Who already doesn't know Kanye West is a complete and total jackass. Well thank you all for today I got announcement."

" Oh -- Oh. -- test cases sites they can't find a job in I T I am selling Halloween stuff on eBay. If you want the best. Pirate can improper ever made. A to a search for those three words on eBay you'll find him very cool. And -- check it out it's awesome or go to a -- Canon dot com. See what my life partner and I have brought and it is awesome you know it now are these artists yet pirate Canon dot com looking up right now girlfriend about it now. By hand and Claritin -- never get sued ways that it is a Salmonella are you can ask the domain with their arms were selling it. -- candidates. Out of there is higher Canon dot com yet we made a candidate and you made this website just to sell that cannon yeah -- That's what they're making more than one -- we got -- really made in -- to in the pipeline. I and I just happen to have a -- a now. I see that makes sense now now we are -- like -- new product they're funny coincidence I'm selling my kitchen set. And if you go to the old Jason dot AARP benefit. Okay this is on the move that far to wrap ups we've never betray us and Canada next week's episode dot com the heck yeah. I like okay I'm go to bed dot com it's ever at a fact. Escalator and the total -- the LE TO. And until next week this is your skeptics guide to the universe dot com."

" Discuss discussion universe is produced by the New England skeptical society. In association with the James Randi educational foundation is -- dot org for more information on this and other episodes. Please visit our website at www. -- skeptics -- is Scott Gordon's four questions suggestions and other feedback. Please use the contact us form our website war send an email to info at the skeptics -- Dutch court costs. If you enjoyed this episode to please help us spread the word I voted for aside -- are leaving -- review on iTunes you can find links to these sites and others. -- to our home page. Appearance is produced by kiddo and he's used with permission."

" Okay."