Title: Here and Now for Wednesday, October 28, 2009

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" And PRI. I'm -- Young it's here and now a UN contractor or a truck driver reportedly used a Kalashnikov rifle to help fight off Taliban fighters says. They storm that UN guest house in Kabul Afghanistan this morning. The militants killed at least a dozen people including an American before they were killed. The Taliban also launched rocket attacks on the presidential palace and a luxury hotel. In neighboring Pakistan another car bomb attack killed at least ninety people today. During secretary of state Hillary Clinton's visit to that country. All of this is a New York Times reports today that the Obama administration. Is considering a shift in strategy in the region Tom Shanker comes -- pentagon and national security for the times Tom. So what is the Obama administration considering in its shift in strategy."

" Well as part of their new strategy review they'll end up deciding. Whether and how. Any more troops will be added to the mission is a proposal from the commander -- journalistically in the crystals to focus on protecting the population. So this is a central Tenet of counterinsurgency strategy to separate the population. The insurgents who intimidate them and all of the corruption and pressure and and the argument goes that -- the population feel secure. They ordered support to central government. The country will grow and stabilized but it's kind of -- risky strategy in some ways because by focusing -- number of troops already on the major population centers spirit effects rendering tax laws of the countryside to the insurgencies."

" Well and in and that seems to his shift because. We understood the thinking was protect the population but it seemed to be more far flung regions."

" That's exactly right for agriculture and Vietnam there's this idea of strategic hamlets were individuals villages were protected by troops what we've done and there. And Afghanistan and those -- far flung remote outpost or religious bullet -- date they are subject to attack in general with. With crystal has decided that they really don't bring. A lot of security to the population. But haven't several hundred troops protecting. Very small pockets of the population. Is still have to listen is drawn from the surge in Iraq. Or all the extra forces went to the major cities to protect a major population centers there's one shift for Afghanistan though general. With Crist wants to include in this idea of population centers. The vital infrastructure that supports the quality of life actually is looking at a couple of the more fertile agricultural areas a a couple of the industrial -- and the major highway systems that link Afghanistan's cities as well as a country to neighboring Pakistan and and in Iran's strategic step for request that really. Means a significant number of new troops and actually -- six -- trying to debate right now."

" Well -- and that's interesting because you wrote the debate is no longer over whether to send more troops but how many."

" I think that that's exactly right Adam Adam. President Obama even has support from the Democrats in congress to at a brigade or two of traders the argument there being that it was the Afghan security forces step up the Americans to step back so I think it is pretty safe to say there will be some -- additional troops added beyond the 21000 already ordered by President Obama. The real question is how fully what they embraced. Populations centric counterinsurgency strategy. -- a -- if so how many more brigades will be assigned to which cities which highway systems which agricultural and industrial areas that's where the debate is right."

" And in his thinking that other parts of the country that are less populated would just be seated to tell them I know. You quote as Senator John Kerry saying some of these areas don't need US troops are already hostile. To the Taliban."

" A combination in the in the -- to develop and introduce you really aren't that strong spare parts because of ethnic and tribal reasons insurgency has been -- But they're also areas where the insurgency. Is in no way a threat to the United States or even a threat to the government -- insurgencies are because of anger from tribes or because of blocking or smuggling Turkish criminal elements and where there really is a politically motivated insurgency. The argument now goes. We can let them wherever we can isolate them that they don't have access to major population centers they are not an immediate threat I mean this is really at. Important decision now because what it says is that the American military is never going to kill off the insurgency but they need to sort of Eagles throttle back its oxygen. For long enough to let the Afghans takeover attempt emissions."

" Obama would seem to now be disappointing. His supporters on the left to wanna him to pull out and even critics on the right like George will who wanted to pull out of Afghanistan."

" I think there is a certain everybody gets a little bit justice is where they and and up because protecting just it is something everybody can appreciate. Letting the strategy district counterterrorism. You know in the empty spaces kind of what I'd want it so does this actually may be shaping up as a grand bargain. So that everybody -- that they can say hey can we got a little something."

" Of the New York Times Tom thanks so much."

" It was a pleasure thank you for --"

" Tip O'Neill late speaker of the house. Called Social Security the third rail of American politics touch it and watch out for angry elderly voters. Will Medicare is the news third rail but will proposed changes to cut five billion dollars in ten years. And enhance coverage for most by cutting waste or diminished coverage for many. Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell warned last week that these are major cuts with serious consequences but the near times and it's for editorializing is that. Republicans are scare mongering and it's time to call them to account. While we -- find out about that but also as -- earth. What exactly is Medicare money get a -- from Stuart Altman he's professor of health policy at Brandeis university's. -- school. He's been advising presidents since Nixon. President Clinton appointed him to the bipartisan commission on Medicare he also advised the Obama transition. On health -- professor of all thank you so much and get right to what exactly is Medicare."

" Well Medicare and its simplest form that's number simple. Is basically it's made up before parts then -- which we're all familiar with we pay your taxes each month when we're working. And I trust fund to set up and that's what provides us if we need hospital care are extended care and nursing home. Or a rehab. Part. That is paid for by a combination of premiums that every one who and it's voluntary you don't have to belong but 95% of people. Who were on part of a by the way part of a every one of belongs who -- paid an automatic automatically. Part B have to choose but as they said everyone chooses and you -- extra rich and you get definitely extra coverage that includes a lot but it's primarily for outpatient care physician care of drugs now. Then we've created port sea and the part C which will talk about a minute is this Medicare Advantage and and you wanna spend time Jimenez set aside and under Medicare part. It's a complicated program people have to sign up with private insurance in the in the government supports them and it's that infamous donut hole it."

" It's there isn't just jump into the donut hole because we were so proud of ourselves who managed to thrashed through this this morning the donut hole. It -- it -- that the -- only pay at a co pay. Until between them and the insurance they've spent a little over 2500 dollars then come as the doughnut hole during which participants pay the full amount. Until they've paid as much as 3200 or so in full amount for the prescription drugs then after that. And the insurance company takes over pretty much all the payments they hardly have any company to get the donut right."

" I think you did it right I think the numbers on the high side are higher than that but I think you've got to ride and it's a complicated plan and it would take me a long time to explain who in the world created that and -- it was created but that's essentially."

" Okay and -- let's go back to see and by the way also just in an overarching way. Medicare is for the elderly Medicaid. As opposed to Medicaid which is primarily for the poor and the engine children."

" And one other thing I would say that. That there are some people out of both on Medicare and Medicaid medical dual eligible so few very poor and you're -- and you're over 65. And I would say one other thing there are few other people who qualify for Medicare. If you're suffering from end stage renal disease -- program you qualify for Medicare even if you're under 65. And there are certain disabled. Who qualify for --"

" Okay Medicare. Advantage. I think this is where the huge controversy is this is where the cuts are planned this Medicare Advantage."

" Medicare Advantage was set up in the mid 1980s that allows people to sign up with private insurance managed care companies. It's it's gone through three generations they changed the name of it but essentially allows people to sit opt out of traditional Medicare. Get their benefits. From nine managed care company and then the government pays the managed care company and the idea was it would give become that the government some competition by using private companies yes and there have been and there is arguments in favor of them because some of these plans. On the -- coordination of care and provide extra benefits they do more efficient way of providing care. And so many people who are traditionally been -- managed care of what he worked for -- this insured by Kaiser on the west coast or tufts health plan here and in the Boston area you know you just traditionally move when you entered Medicare you could just take that on okay."

" So -- Obama. White House and the Democrats in congress. Are talking about making cuts specifically to Medicare Advantage what's the debate over Medicare Advantage what's the what's perceived as the prominent."

" Well beginning in 1990s and then. The congress began -- extra funding. For certain areas that are on Medicare. Advantage. We have a very that's it that this country is broken up into a many different places and in some places the spending in Medicare is much lower than in others. And the ones where was spending was low like in rural areas -- on the west coast in Seattle and Portland. They wanted more money for Medicare Advantage and so manicured the image payments from the government began to exceed. What Medicare traditionally pays for the same people. And so over fourteen it was Susan under the act act averages around fourteen to 15% more more and in some places so much at 30% more."

" And I would like to Medicare Advantage. Participants again they pay a little extra. In addition to their premiums that their Medicare be what would you they get extra."

" Well the fair assessment is the critics of this stable it does is go to the insurance companies that's totally not true. Yes the insurance companies in some cases to -- be many cases make more. As a result of that but a lot of it goes to Medicare extra benefits. It goes for reduced or eliminated premiums you've talked about the donut hole some of these Medicare Advantage planes fill in that don't know at all. It goes for some extra benefits here in the air but for the most part it fills in. A lower premiums low co payments and extra benefits particularly on the drug's side."

" An and they get other extra benefits like for instance hearing aids at times we we read health club memberships yes they do I mean the health club memberships there."

" You don't sound like fees to thing but -- designed to keep people healthy sure."

" So. So bring -- to the heart of the debate their."

" The -- the Democrats say that in making some cuts to Medicare Advantage they can. Would take some of that money and fund more benefits for people in general Medicare."

" Yeah well did the basic argument in favor of the cuts are 21 is why. Is that because we pay so much more there are Medicare Advantage plans that really are not doing not much. They just they just they're able to provide all these extra benefits and not do good things like coordination of care and more efficient system. That's not true of all of them but that's so that's hi man number one item number two. Is why should Medicare pay for more benefits for just some population and by the way we're talking about eleven million. We're 25% of all Medicare people now want to Medicare Advantage."

" Well input into the leadership council of aging."

" You know that's that it -- some of that extra money gets built into the part B premium and so I guess there is some most of it is coming out of -- be the general tax money. Or or of the trust fund."

" Also -- again there's the question is it fair. That there are some seniors who get these extra benefits if in fact of maybe the playing field could be made a little more even if there were some cuts made of course. Seniors who get those benefits and pay for women. Feel they've -- them live longer and healthier lives are outraged that they may be taken away we're gonna. Continue our look at the battle over Medicare with Stuart Altman of Brandeis University when we come back some solutions some suggestions. We'll see not everybody is happy that in a minute here now."

" Funding for here and now comes from the math works creators of -- lab and simulate technical computing software. Dedicated to accelerating the pace of discovery in engineering and science worldwide. On the web at math works dot com."

" Welcome back we're getting a -- in Medicare from Stuart Altman a professor of health policy at Brandeis university's Heller school he is an extensive resume in Washington knows. When he speaks he works his work for president on both sides of the advise them about government health insurance programs and mr. we had just explained this. -- he said the new third rail of health care reform which is. What has sort of focused on Medicare Advantage this as a part of the Medicare program that millions of seniors. Pay in tunic is -- little extra benefits but now there's talk in health care reform of making some cuts. And did we -- near times editorial that talks about Medicare with Nicole Medicare scare mongering. They say that. That these cuts would make Medicare bidder for more people by enhancing drug coverage reducing premiums. Eliminating co pays safe for preventive services and helping to keep Medicare solvent which she review. Of whether -- not -- have to be made in Medicare Advantage."

" Well I I I think it's fair to say that to the extent that the funds that are being cut from Medicare Advantage do go back into the Medicare program. And there are cases where does go there's going to be some improvements in them drug benefits one of the three things the times but most of the money. Most of the money in the cuts are gonna go to support. The coverage for people not on Medicare. Now that doesn't say that this is not fear of course fairness is in the eye of the beholder. And for those people on Medicare Advantage they will see a cut in benefits. For most people on Medicare it will either improve this situation. Or at least leave it alone and yes it will put off for a little while. A very little while of the problem we're gonna have been funding Medicare it will not -- solve the Medicare."

" But we want to ask you about the solvency of Medicare the first just what what cuts do you foresee happening in Medicare Advantage -- we we mentioned that they made. Lose benefits like hearing aids or health club memberships as you said those aren't frills you know. Well I think it's."

" More than I think it's the premiums in the extra drugs I think it depends critically on what part of the country -- and and and what the differences in the plan that you go for some plans. That have been relying on these extra payments beginning twenty to 30% more and really -- doing very much for the cuts are going to be very significant. For those plans that are an urban areas or in plans that really know how to manage care. If these cuts are phased in over time and then not too draconian. I think the impact on benefits will be --"

" Well Bill Nelson the democratic senator from Florida is pushing an amendment that would preserve Medicare Advantage programs and benefits. In states where plans cost the government less than traditional Medicare this because so many people are in the plan and that. Includes his state you know Florida. Almost a million seniors and the plan but then that would -- seniors in you know North Dakota."

" Well to be fair and one of the reasons why he can propose that is that the cost of traditional Medicare and Florida was off the charts. So if you compare of what they get in Florida for a traditional Medicare to what they get in Seattle. It's probably a 40% difference so. They can afford to have Medicare payments on their Medicare Advantage -- or right and other parts of the country they can't."

" Well and then here's and other things that critics say they they say first of all if we start cutting away Medicare Advantage. Some companies that can carry Medicare Advantage he's commercial insurers that work with the government and private insurers. May drop it and also get all the Hinske who ran Medicare under president George HW bush so another problem is that many places like nursing homes. Depend on extra revenue not just from Medicare but from Medicare Advantage to subsidize. The patients who don't have it."

" I think she's correct and it's not only that it's also certain physician groups that depend upon decapitated payments from Medicare Advantage. Again I think what's critical isn't so much that we don't have cuts it's that these cuts are phased in. And that -- not so draconian and that they coup was substantial disruption. The idea of leaving. 15%. Differential I think is off the table I think it's just a question of how we. 50% extra money going going to Medicare Advantage I think did have fairness dictates that that be cut that it's how we do it and how tough those cuts."

" Questions for you Stuart Altman when you say the big question is whether Medicare system does sustainable in the long run is that."

" I think the answer is yes but it will the changes I wanna make it very clear I have a conflict of interest -- Medicare. I want I'm wanted to continue our."

" During the next question which is a lot of people say when professor at Brandeis sweetness fairly okay. Will have to start looking at who get Medicare that it may not be for all seems."

" I believe in the concept of social insurance I do believe. That people of higher income should campaign more and by the way let's be very clear. I yes I am doing okay thank you and I. Let's send having having a job at my age. But and I as a result are paying twice as much for my Medicare part B as people who have low income right we are -- income relating Medicare and I think that's okay. But I don't think we should say and make Medicare. Totally an income related program the fact that we have a social insurance program is key to Medicare and I would hate to see that be destroyed. Well and what. Do you think finish your thought. About what you would like to sit well at the end what we need is we need a combination of things there is no question that going forward whether it's five years from now or eight years from now. We're gonna need a combination of more money into Medicare and we're gonna need to Medicare to change the way it pays for care. And to develop more efficient system Medicare. With the as much as I -- have support for it. Does not -- correctly. And there's a lot of waste in Medicare. So that we can we need to change Medicare Medicare is not broken but Medicare has problems. And if we don't do that. If we live with the same income and continue to pay the same way then we are gonna have a."

" Serious crisis or say when you say waste you're not talking about health club memberships for the elderly -- fraud and yes."

" Well I'm talking about two things I mean we combine waste and and fraud fraud should be stopped."

" Second waste is when we do things inappropriately and and we can do it better by doing the last you know like when it disappeared I'm on at a hospital because she's gonna get about ten procedure she didn't exactly. -- Stuart Altman professor of health policy at Brandeis university's -- school. Stuart thanks so much as -- it's a pleasure take a second says that you know I tomorrow gonna take a look at a new documentary that remembers the late. After John because you remember him in the deer hunter Dog Day Afternoon. About freedom in the godfather. We were married this extraordinary after tomorrow still ahead today a conversation personal commitment what does it mean. Here now."

" Support for here and now comes from the listeners of WBUR Boston where the program is produced. Hinckley Allen and Snyder where partners have been giving clients practical legal advice for over a hundred years throughout new England and now including Connecticut online it has -- dot com. And the Institute of Contemporary Art on Boston's waterfront presenting the work of a diverse range of contemporary artists performers and more. IC EA Boston dot org."

" I'm running young welcome back to here now okay eroding used to saying turnpike series. People living between Pennsylvania and New York alone in New Jersey Turnpike are trying to decide yankees Phillies Phillies yankees as a series. Travels back and forth between Philly and the Bronx starting tonight. When the defending World Series champion Philadelphia Phillies take on the New York Yankees -- 103. Games this past season. Then writers covering the games for Sports Illustrated -- For the last few years we've had Cinderella teams make it's in a series the Tampa Bay Rays in 2008 there. Colorado Rockies in 2007 this year to marquee match up so first of all. Excited about this question."

" The best American League team in the yankees'. -- powerful offenses this will be the first time since 1927. That the World Series will feature each league. Team leader at home runs -- runs scored. And another -- to get excited or proud that they were gonna see some of the premier pitchers in the league three times each possibly. Talking about the Yankees ace CC sabathia. Consistently they've quickly studied guys have a lot in common. Their former teammate on the Cleveland Indians. -- left tended. But their former Cy Young award winners. And they should match up against each other potentially three times in Wednesday night's game one in game four in game -- circles."

" Okay all excited I think game two and game to those seen former Boston Red Sox pitcher. Pedro Martinez are former love here in Boston but. In fact he's made it to the post season six times but always with the Red Sox now he's with the Phillies. And he'll be matchup with AJ Burnett of the Yankees that that's getting game to. -- got all the hyperbole all these great leaders great pitchers great teams. Does that sort of raise the bar it'd be great games."

" Absolutely and ager Martina that you mentioned is that it static key here. He's taken to calling himself the old -- during this post season but it certainly hasn't been pitching like that so far. And hit acquisition by the general manager Ruben -- of the facilities. There's a big reason why they've gotten this -- a big reason why they have a chance. Even against a team as powerful as rich as loaded with the Yankees."

" And is hated in some quarters I can say that. I'm from New York urgently. Well. Into other characters. The stadiums and and the new Yankee Stadium in the Bronx and Citizens Bank Park in Philly. Howard they gonna. -- year old."

" Well be put these places are considered launching pads and baseball parlance. Particularly Yankee Stadium. Short right field porch the Yankees have had little trouble cooking Ballmer that wall all evening long. -- of course a great slugger Greg Ryan Howard should have a little trouble as well. One key for the Yankees in my mind. Is that Mark Teixeira really gets things going the first base stood for the Yankees keep struggled a bit in the proceedings fittingly QO five. Which is way below Harry performed during the regular season when he emerged in the real. MVP candidate in the American League you're gonna have to keep up a little bit here and I think perhaps playing he's been books that might just be this thing to do with."

" These little band boxes these little jewel box is all stadiums so so a lot of home runs it's always fun. In the fans they're both east coast. Teams. Fans from vibrant cities that shall we say it. All have a colorful approach to their cheering."

" You're actually read about that you mentioned the New Jersey Turnpike come outlandish to dispute could. And on the Amtrak train lines between York and Philadelphia. Over the next week or so. I think that in the normal case out surgery get to the players are coming -- Philadelphia fans can really you know kind of wry. Communicate maybe among the game a little bit."

" Of course eight you know this is -- a huge hitter for the Yankees."

" Of course but yeah he -- put cute and struggled in the past. Did she can be almost an event like state this October. Well it says that I'm seeing the ball and hitting the ball he's having one of the greatest Upton to -- to anyone ever had so far. I don't think that the Phillies fans will be able to put a -- and give too much."

" But they will try to think that. That's been writer of Sports Illustrated getting us ready for the World Series that starts tonight Ben thanks so much. -- Some until we were gonna hear a lot about peoples mothers and their shoe there -- no confidence in such. I'm New Yorker I can say that here and now."

" What should be done with convicted sex offenders who've done jail time and yet raise concerns that they may re offend. -- since the late ninety's more more states are turning to civil commitment while it's being questioned for federal prisoners in the case before the Supreme Court. It is illegal for states to keep sex offenders confined. After they've done their time. And here in Massachusetts the district attorney is asking the state to just the law so that juries rather than judges decide whether someone should be civilly committed. This after a judge released did not civilly recommit a convicted defender despite pleas from the prosecutor. That offender went onto attack alone in five days after his release. With the -- just wanna get an introduction to civil commitments with someone involved in deciding who gets them. Doctor Anna Salter is a psychologist she consults with the Wisconsin department of corrections she evaluates sex offenders forcible commitment doctor sultan. We know there are also civil commitment laws for people for instance who are mentally in Allen might be danger to themselves under others. But how many states has civil commitment laws for sex offenders and what are the general requirements."

" Clinton states now have civil commitment laws for sex offenders. And the -- pretty similar from state to state. Perfect attendance should be eligible have to have aids diagnosis that leads him to look we have fans affectionately. For example schizophrenia. Would not just like typically it's called schizophrenia different cause people to commit sex offense of whereas -- feeling it would supply. He also slushy have to be more likely than not in both states to re offense -- usually -- kind of -- risk level that included in and the law. And they have to have them mostly to serious difficulty in controlling his urged Juliet --"

" And we understand that one of the reasons that state started. Using peace civil commitment programs. With the hope of treating people while in jail so are that they could be released and possibly. Helped."

" Well that's controversy -- apparently that's what some people believe critics of the law say that law was simply intended to keep them off the streets so what it. Actually built into the law -- treatment that you treat them and they aren't released until they've lowered the rest of the effect."

" Well and critics say the majority are released they stay in civil commitment because. Some treatments don't work."

" Well. Some of the treatments. I don't want but the chances when -- Depending on the top 10%. Of high risk sex offenders it's really not surprise me that not all of them are able to lower -- friends."

" you're part of a review process."

" More than ever feel it's connected to an actual trial. For example I do have a commitment to valuations that kind of odd couple for the federal government that I've done sixty you know all for different states particularly if they've -- Of Iowa and others get their minor differences between. -- at the bottom line is that it typically takes more than one evaluation. To refer them for have a commitment and he goes to a trial. And they -- has the opportunity to defend itself. Fully. In make the claim that he did not meet criteria and of course the prosecution. Claiming that he now."

" And then and then how is it reviewed down the road."

" Does that's different depending on the state -- substation and automatically view every year for example in other states they have -- have to apply for a -- review after. Last time. But there is have a built in review process."

" Well in -- reviews at the front in -- news. Being considered for civil commitment how often do you conclude that they should be civilly committed."

" Well it. In my experience is that about half the time that you have to remember that's not half -- the sex offenders because the only sex offenders clogging. First in the air hybrid have -- offenders. When they come to me they're already -- screening process that's probably. Let's talk about 90% effective."

" Will we know that you're not here's a defender of it's sex offenders but can you explain that to people who you know are reacting to these stories we're across the country and they don't think that anyone who is considered. A serious offenders should be the least we know other people like Andrew flashed. He was -- the symbolic suggestion net all had a file should be held on an island simply because there untreatable. So can you just briefly explain to people how is it that someone might not go to civil commitment as opposed to how is it that they do."

" Well I think the public has an idea that all sex offenders those things stand that they are high risk -- but study after study after study after study. Almost come to the same conclusion and that is face a range of sex offenders had sex offender should have a 4% chance of re offended. And that sex offender could have a 76%. Chance of re offend within the first ten years. Nobody cares about the ones who do not re offense so if you get one re offense everybody thinks that's typical. Of sex offenders. -- it it's really not true. Secondly the probably retaining all of them is we would have to choose between funding or universities confirmed that her presence. When you're painting in some states close to a 100000 dollars per center per year for civil commitment every ten offenders system million dollars. To say that we could now also incarcerate and 90% of sex offenders who aren't high risk. And then took those such as they can. I don't think people understand the impact that would have."

" Is there anything to be done to make sure that -- most -- those most likely to acidity. Are held in civil commitment."

" I think -- profits is pretty good because we have new instruments in the last few years which predict with much greater accuracy. Who is likely to be offended who isn't I think the process for getting them and it's pretty good it's a lot more difficult to determine. When they've made changes that would cause you to release them."

" One last question here in Massachusetts there's a move to switch consideration of civil commitment at the beginning from a judge to a jury the Middlesex County attorney. General here -- thinks that juries in the much tougher more likely. To send. People to civil commitment then judges to any thoughts on that."

" test of time for the judges and juries. And I didn't surprise for -- judges and juries are fairly tough to get that they don't take depriving someone. Civil liberties politely."

" It's really interesting because when you hear these these stories in the children in particular who disappear there's such public outrage. They you'd think the that would transfer to a jury but you're saying that even juries to you've seen sort of stop short and reconsider do I want him. Literally a sent someone twice for the same crime which is what civil commitments."

" Yes -- and the victim of the bears and the offender is and if they look presentable and talked well that has an enormous and on jury but you must remember everybody's afraid most of all of the of the killer. And 60%. Of sadistic killers have no criminal record. -- kind of -- up all of that. So horrible stuff that goes on by focusing entirely on -- Pete Hoekstra and the majority of serial killers don't have the prior record."

" Up to an assault or psychologist to consults for the Wisconsin department of corrections. And also evaluates sex offenders -- civil commitment for the federal government on that. Very somber note abducted -- thank you so much. You remember we'd love to hear your thoughts on this or any story -- here now dot org click on contact us send us an email with them in from you. You're listening here now."

" Support for here now comes in part from the Rockefeller Foundation and its campaign for American workers. More at rock found dot org. It to come right."

" And some Ronald termite knocked on -- and tasted compounded the and that is why your cousin I found through -- today."

" That Ogden Nash reading his column the termite on the CB becomes of the new book of poems for kids and their parents. The book connects poetry and science to illustrate Darwin's theory of evolution. It's called that treat that time built a celebration of nature science and imagination. Do -- fret. And do not -- You are in time you can't follow. No matter what you say or do. You are in time. Time he -- And everything that is to me. -- time. Upon this tree the poems were selected by and some like that one -- by the US children's poet laureate. She's Mary Ann hoberman and she joins us in the studio lot on Q and oxygen by her collaborator Linda Winston a cultural anthropologist and teacher. Linda welcomed -- as well thank you and Marion a first of all who knew this there was a children's poet laureate. Not indeed I guess it's brand new. And that poem that we heard the -- time built that the book is of the same name. Is -- which currency in the poem you do not different -- doubt you are in time you can't fault how."

" I don't know exactly what it means even though I wrote it I don't remember who said. This person said you can't fly out of time and ever since then I heard many years ago -- unto -- it's one of my mountains. Terrible things can happen but you can't five time and so I wrote this little person managing -- so beautifully. You'll."

" And it seems like a perfect thing to say to a child who might be thinking how is -- that I get and stay on -- search which I'm learning is a circle and spinning around you know actually can't foment anti matter. And I I have to ask you it's a beautiful book becomes an audio CD filled with some of the poems. And there are also comments and at the bottom of the page you wanna get to that that track parallels between columns and science. But we understand this about. The evolution of life Charles Darwin might be essential character -- ask you about this because you're marking the 200 anniversary of Charles Darwin's birth has only 39% of Americans. The -- his theory of evolution. We you thinking about that when you're putting this together for."

" Can't I had the feeling and she did to of course that. Evolution was going to be falling on hard times in the public school districts in many states. And I felt and send her -- one of the few people who can make an important difference now. Only need to do is collect fifteen or twenty of the poems you've already written. And flew right film pros links. That will show how they're connected to darlings concept. And at that point Marion recited a poem is just into poised and confident -- actually let's hear a little bit of an extra points."

" Barrett right -- I often influenced. Cadences and -- and project can claim with from the great writers for children and wrote suggests those stories happening elephant got his. Trunk had a camera Compuware an apartment the end of each of these stories and it the end of have a camel hump. He broke the Camel's hump it's an ugly language well he -- he -- citizen but a reunion at home we get from having to continue. -- from congress to move when they haven't ineptitude who became the home. Concerns come home to his black and blue that rent them wouldn't leave me. Until I wrote my own home which is caught and employees. And actor played means man. And here is that -- this is really on the books. The next time notices. In the slow down from manager to actually considered the right. All of it scientists can change for the related TUT unions related TU TU related to be unique to fathers and mothers sisters and Brothers. And the people we see you we think. The chimpanzees gorillas panel and healthier and -- the wall while he's a remarkable creature and share most of our futures. And the difference between the small. And this book in my dream mentality. This is what I would love to -- and I with a child."

" It just just some sampling -- opponent I really like is Adam from Adam by Ralph Waldo Emerson and it read. Adam from Adam you on as far as moved from -- and start from storm. And when he moved to. Nobody really knew that don't --"

" in our common comment we point to -- But that's what is so remarkable about poets that they often anticipate scientific. Discoveries and come home."

" Here's some mothers. You have Marion -- written a poem about -- but so did Emily Dickinson. The pedigree of honey. The pedigree of honey does not concern would be clover any kind him he's aristocracy. But that lets you explain to children. We will pollination Smith yes yes. -- polar bear."

" polar bear. By being quite. Gives up his camouflage at night. And yet. Without a fault or care. He wonders here meanders there. And -- treads the -- flew lose completely unconcerned with faux news. Or after dark. Nobody dare us to set out after. Polar banners."

" Here's another one yeah luckily I used a discovery. A discovery. I'm my -- smooth green belly they're -- no button hadn't a little bit. -- Valerie earth has flies. Flies with their bones are on the outside if he can. -- that we think that. Poetry has nothing to do with science and science has nothing to do with poetry -- anyone to Britain each one of them I think seems to be. A mysterious kind."

" Mountain to climb out of work there's lots and lots of teachers and kids and for sure that concept and evolution are com. But it isn't fair to think that they're not. Able to be understood if there properly presented and -- it's very often do. This wonderful poem. About affront that -- has in this. Collection and when I showed the book too -- biologist friend she fixed element Coleman chief said this poem is science. It's many different branches of science line by line list of."

" Polly wiggle -- what -- tactical bull frog -- on long legs joke around -- generally speaking countries -- Spybot Flickr eyes wet skin."

" Cold black spot in -- Mikey but the on long legs Jerome jelly eggs -- in wet bug."

" Highly political."

" Fund. That is the US children's poet laureate Mary and -- government together with cultural anthropologist Linda Winston. They've put together the book the treatment time built a celebration nature science and imaginations Jason Nelson concert and CD. Couple last one's just splitting. Linda you read this on the CD could you read of course it's enhanced Christian Anderson it's on page sixteen."

" Just living is not enough. Said the butterfly. One must have sunshine. Freedom. And a little flower. With a wonderful thing until tune we want to close with Christine -- George greeting her old film speaks. What a wonderful message to keep to keep things -- you and me. It in as I told you young without playing. It won't take autumn's patient. Before you snake you war first moon."